| Author | Message | ||
     Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Hello! I just published Stereoscopic Player! You can download it at http://mitglied.lycos.de/stereo3d/ for free. Please try it and give me feedback. It depends on YOUR suggestions which features I implement next. :-) Peter | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Does it support pageflipping? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Not yet. I'm currently working on a bugfix release and afterwards I'll implement new features. Win3d support is one of the next things that will be done. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Hello! Verion 0.5 of Stereoscopic Player is available now at http://mitglied.lycos.de/stereo3d/! New in version 0.5: Added the following viewing methods: * Gray Anaglyphs Yellow - Blue * Half Color Anaglyphs Red - Cyan * Half Color Anaglyphs Yellow - Blue * Color Anaglyphs Yellow - Blue Other improvements and fixes: * Improved error handling * Corrected YUV-RGB conversion * Corrected hotspot positions of DVD menues * Step Forward and new Step Backward commands accessible with arrow keys * Possibility to open URLs * Repeat and Keep Aspect Ratio settings will be remembered * New option for turning off automatic playback when opening a file * Some minor bug fixes | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Fantasic Peter! Thank you! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Works perfectly on my P4! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Are you going to provide support for all DVD player? thank you. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Currently, I am working on the following topics: 1) Internet updates for video library. This means you don't have to choose the correct input format yourself, but can load it from the Internet. 2) Possibility to export a library item. Useful if your files cannot be found in the online library. If you provide such an exported file in the same directory as your video, Stereoscopic Player will find it and import it in its library. 3) Win3D support for shutterglasses. Currently, only sync-doubling mode is supported. 4) Increase DVD decoder compatibility. The problem is, the current DirectShow filter used by Stereoscopic Player does not handle dynamic format changes correctly, so it only supports PowerDVD decoder by now. I will NOT make my own decoder, because there are already some excellent decoders. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Will this player work with any shutter glass system? Specific drivers needed? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Currently it supports the over/under format for use with sync-doublers only. Win3D support (www.win3d.com) will be available in a few months. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Peter, Is there any way to save the converted output, meaning can the player also be used as a format converter? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
> Is there any way to save the converted output, > meaning can the player also be used as a > format converter? Yes and no. Not in Stereoscopic Player itself, but if you use GraphEdit (part of the DirectX SDK) you can build your own conversion filter graph. Stereoscopic Player registers the Stereo Transformation Filter for this purpose. If you need more detailed information, please feel free to contact me! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Peter could you elaborate on how to save the output, I'm sure others would like to know as well. Turns out your program is a great converter as well! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
ok I'm able to use graphedit but I still need help on writing out a new avi file .... | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Insetad of VideoRendere put on the end at first some compresor, than AviMux, than File Write But doing such operaion in Adobe Premiere or similar software is much more efficient ... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
aha apparently graphedit was the problem got it writing now by using avi mux and file write filters | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
MH, Can premiere load in a graphedit file and use it? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Premiere cannot use GraphEdit files, but Michal has written 3D plugins for Premiere. I know my Stereo Transformation Filter is a bit complicate to use, since it requires knowledge about GraphEdit and DirectShow. I'll write a guide soon and put it on my homepage. Maybe I write a user interface to simplify the process too. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Thanks again for writing this filter! I find it most interesting  | ||
| Björn Rating: N/A |
Hello, Great tool, but I have a problem: The system: a geforce 4 with dual output, two beamers (1024x768 each) with pol-filters, silverscreen and so else. W2k as OS. In the nvidia-drive nview is enables for a desktop-resolution of 2048x768. I can open a 3d-dvd (e.g. alien adventure) and in the window I see both frames (left/right, mode side by side) decoded perfectly. But I see both pictures (left and right) only if I have placed the player-window to the first screen. If I want to move the player-window over both screens of the nview-desktop, so that the left picture is shown on the first nview-desktop and the right picture is shown on the second nview-desktop, the first picture is shown, the second not. If I go to fullscreen mode (scaled or unscaled), I also only get the left image and the right one is completly dark. Any suggestions? Is it possible to use the programm with that configuration? Or have the programmer to add special support for nview-modes? Any other who get it running? | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
http://www.teamxbox.com/news.php?id=4604 http://www.razor3d.com/ Razor3D today announced the release of Virtual FX, a television set-top box that converts any standard 2D video into real stereographic 3D, instantly and in real-time. The Virtual FX adds digital effects to any type of video from any video source including VHS, DVD, video game consoles and digital camcorders. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
To Björn: By default the player uses hardware overlay for best performance, but this is limited to one screen. But if you disable "Allow YUV mode for side by side" in the settings-dialog, it will work, but performance is lower. A second, more complicated method would be to change the settings of the Video Renderer (File->Video Properties->Filter, select "Video Renderer", press "Details...", only available when playing a movie). Changing Video Renderer properties will affect all progams, not only Stereoscopic Player! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
To Björn: let us know... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
"By default the player uses hardware overlay for best performance, but this is limited to one screen. But if you disable "Allow YUV mode for side by side" in the settings-dialog, it will work, but performance is lower." Peter, I tried it, and it works; but performance is indeed lower (i.e. movements are not smooth any more). Is hardware overlay generally limited to one screen? Is this also the case for NVidia Quadro 4 cards, or is there a setting that would give you the best of both worlds (i.e. hardware overlay for both screens)? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
For almost all cards, overlay is limited to one screen. Maybe some professional graphic cards support better overlay modes. On my gForce 4 patched to Quadro (to allow Stereo OpenGL) it does not work. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
I had tested almost all exiting graphic cards ... On profesional (Wildcat 6xxx 7xxx) the overlay is not supported at all. On all others (Matrox, nVidia) overaly works only on one screen giving black on the second. The solution is clear - forget overlay usage. But this require replacing a lot of defualt Microsoft DirectShow components. The result than work even faster than with Overlay surfaces :-). | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Thanks Michal for providing us with this information. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Thank you Peter and Michal for the clarification. Michal, I am not sure what you mean by replacing default DirectShow components resulting in higher speed than with overlay surfaces. Do you mean using quad buffered OpenGL in nClone mode is better, or are you suggesting a new approach, based on extended desktop with quad buffered stereo and overlay disabled? When I tried Peter's suggestion to disable YUV mode, I got excellent 3D but with jerky movements (2.66 GHZ P4 running @ 100% utilization). Thanks | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Does anybody tried Matrox Pharelia? I've been told it supports 2 screens (out of 3) in the same way. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
I was testing older models than Perhelia ... But I do not expect it shoudl work for overaly ... | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Anonymous: I am suggesting something on witch I am working 2 years in cooperaion with nVida drivers developers :-) and what is the core of DepthQ software. Giving full 30 FPS for movies in 1240x1024 per eye resolution (1024x2480 source movie) without any framedrops and DoblyDigital AC3 sound ... It is fully functional now and several LigtpseedDesign clients use this ... But DepthQ is a comercial project and I can not disscuse the core details. You should make another point of view on the problem: You will be probably more happy if you rediscover the best solution yourself :-). | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
I found this on the net: http://www.matrox.com/mga/workstation/video/technology/dual_overlay.cfm The Parhelia supports dual overlay, but I am not sure if it supports ONE video on two screens. | ||
| Björn Rücker Rating: N/A |
@peter: Thx for your reply and help. If I disable overlay (as you described) it works now and the 3d-effect is visible there. Your player is definitively the only I found which runs so far. Good work ! But on a 2,6 Ghz P4 with a gforce 4 (two beamers and a polarisation projection system) it is bucking, the performance is not optimal and the image-quality is not the same as I have normaly on a dvd. So it is not the maximum fun we can await from an imax 3d dvd... So a question to Peter: Perhaps add support for the more3d-driver (http://www.more3d.com, there is a demoversion available for free for 30 days) could be a solution ? I have the more3d-driver here on my projection system running for directx-games like c&c generals and so else - playing games on a 4 x 2 m screen in 3D is realy cool ;-) They also have an own player, but this player can only play mpeg files (as they told me) and no dvd's. I think your player with their driver would be a very fine combination .... I have contact by email to the guys from more3d and they are very cooperatively and helpful. They told me that it would be perhaps realy easy with their driver to get it to work and they ask me two weeks ago if I have contact with you peter (I told them "I have no contact actualy"). I will send them a message about this discussion here, so let us hear what they have to say. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Björn Rücker: Peter will probably tell you that it is technologicaly impossible to combine the more3d code with the code on witch he is working. In additon for stereo-video playback the more3d is absolutely not neccesary - it will be more easy to implement the more3d futures directly without more3d usage. If you work for a company and have some money for the projections on witch you work you should really try DepthQ ... Stereoscopic DVD playback with dual connectros output is fully supported at full fps with great performance CPU reserve ... | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
#### But on a 2,6 Ghz P4 with a gforce 4 (two #### beamers and a polarisation projection #### system) it is bucking I have almost the same configuration (2.5 GHz P4) and the same problem. I now have contact with more3D but I'm not sure if it will help with this problem. The Microsoft Video Renderer used in my player uses DirectX and I don't know why it is so slow. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Great news: The DirectX Video Mixing Renderer 9 supports YUV output over both screen at the same performance of the default Video Renderer in overlay mode (which does not work over both screens). If you install DirectX 9 SDK and my player (both are available for free) you can already test it using GraphEdit. Navigating in DVD menus is a bit complicated, but it works! Works fast in Win 2000 too. Next version of Stereoscopic Player will make it more easy to use Video Mixing Renderer 9. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Here's a short description how to play 3D DVDs using my Stereo Transformation Filter and Video Mixing Renderer. After you have installed DirectX 9 SDK, you can use GraphEdit. Use Graph->Insert Filter to build the following graph:  Before connecting the Video Mixing Renderer 9 to the Stereo Transformation Filter, set the Stereo Transformation Filter properties:  You can navigate in the DVD using the DVD Navigator properties.  Click right on a filter and choose "Filter Properties..." to display a property page. Please note: You need the commercial verion of Cyberlink PowerDVD decoder. The trial does not include the DirectShow filter used in this graph. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
I did some (non-stereoscopic) tests using Video Mixing Renderer 9 over both screens (P4 2.5 GHz, dual channel DDR-RAM, geForce 4). I played a HDTV 1080p Windows Media file (Corel Reef Adventure IMAX trailer from http://windowsmedia.com/9series/DemoCenter/VideoQuality.asp?page=6&lookup=VideoQuality) and got 22 fps (the video has 24 fps). This means the latest processors (> 3 GHz) should be able to play stereo video using two projectors up to 1920 x 1080 pixel! | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Peter this is great news. I assume that you can play side by side mpeg2 files (e.g. 1440x576) as well using your DVD approach above. Are you still planning to support OpenGL now that Win3D is gone? Michal, I understand that you can't talk about DepthQ. Could you tell us though, which hardware configuration you used (or what the minimum hardware requirements are) to achieve 0 dropped frames @ 1280x1024 resolution per eye? Thanks | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Michal, Masuji and Peter. It occurs to me that those who so abruptly removed Win3D from the general public may use this forum to obtain information on the capabilities of your software and what future direction it is taking. Take care ! | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
#### Are you still planning to support OpenGL #### now that Win3D is gone? OpenGL prototype is already working. Next player version will support OpenGL. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
"OpenGL prototype is already working. Next player version will support OpenGL." Peter this is amazing how fast you were able to do this. Great work, the entire 3D community will more than appreciate this. Is there any guess from your side as to when the next player or beta version will be available? Thanks again for an outstanding piece of work. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Anonymous: HW configuration required for the performance mentioned above 1240x1024 per eye resolution (1024x2480 source movie) , playback at 25 fps: ASUS P4T533 moterboard with 2.24 GHz PIV, 533 FSB, dual chanel 1066MHz RIMM memory. As you see the key to the speed is the memory architecture, not the CPU. Graphic card - Quadro 4 750 XGL. We used a proprietary speed optimized video compression algorithm. We can work even with better movies now (or at 30 fps) om machine with following parameters: 800 MHz FSB, PIV at 3 GHz, dual chanel 400 MHz memory, Quadro FX 5000. I do not have this machine at home - I do not rememeber the motherboard. A simple dual IDE disk RAID array used in both casess .... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
What you guys think about using two HDTV decoder boards as these: http://www.mikrom.de/products/mvc100.html But need player which can to play left and right mpeg2 streams in sync. P.S. Michal, please send to me (vsv2000@mail.com) price of DepthQ digital server HD version. Thanks. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
Since I offer my software for free, I will not buy HDTV decoder boards because I would never get back the investment. It's more interesting for commercial solutions. I even doubt if it is really necessary to use special hardware. My HDTV tests on consumer equipment are very promising, furthermore software solutions are more flexible and will be adopted by more users. Some words about Win3D: It's sad that I'm not allowed to integrate Win3D support in the player. It would have enabled pageflipped video playback on many graphic boards. I have downloaded the SDK and the newest driver before it disappeared from their homepage. Very likely I will add Win3D support to the player, but only for me, it will not be available to the public as long I get no free license. #### It occurs to me that those who so abruptly #### removed Win3D from the general public may #### use this forum to obtain information on the #### capabilities of your software and what #### future direction it is taking. They will not benefit from their findings, because if they only copy my players features, they will make no money since my player is free and their software would be probably not. By the way, it would be great if they new owner of Win3D would reveal his identity and clear up the situation. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Peter, thank you for professional opinion! Your player have possibility to play two streams, synced by timecode? Or you can provide information about another commercially available player? Thanks in advance, Serge V. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Accroding usage of dual HDTV decoding boards ... It will probably work , we did not try this up to now ... But: - Playback of one stream in DepthQ opr Peter player with both movie data encoded removes the synchronization problem ... - it is impossible to genlock the mpeg2 decoder boards RAMDAC. With softwere solution you can use dual output graphic card with genlocked out (Wildcat, Quadro FX2000). So you can get for dual output absolutely precise sync. - with better computer we can work with higher than HDTV per eye resolution - the board probably does not support DolbyDigital AC3 sound - you will get only dual source output. With DepthQ you can get HW page flipping, output for autostereoscopic monitors ... almost all sorts of output witch have sense ... - price of software solution could be always modified do be better than the HW solution | ||
| Bjön Rücker Rating: N/A |
> Björn Rücker: Peter will probably tell you that it is technologicaly impossible to combine the more3d code with the code on witch he is working. @Michael+Peter: was just a thought / an idear. I am not the guru in 3d-driver-programming and all that internal graphic-card-stuff - I just want 3d ;-) > Great news: The DirectX Video Mixing Renderer 9 > supports YUV output over both screen at the same performance of the default Video Renderer in > overlay mode (which does not work over both screens). Sounds realy great ! > If you install DirectX 9 SDK and my player >(both are available for free) you can already > test it using GraphEdit. Next version of > Stereoscopic Player will make it more easy > to use Video Mixing Renderer 9. waiting waiting waiting ... ;) Regards, Björn | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Michal, thanks for the hardware description. It looks like a mainstream PC can handle it. The 2480x1024 resolution seems to be beyond the mpeg2 (high profile high level) specs; at least my mp2 encoders cannot exceed 2000x1100 or so. Did you achieve these results with uncompressed AVIs or (if you used MPEG2), which encoder allows you to encode these high resolutions? Thanks again. Peter, can you already foresee when your next player version with the video mixing renderer and the OpenGL features might be available? Thank you very much for this great contribution. David | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
#### Peter, can you already foresee when your #### next player version with the video mixing #### renderer and the OpenGL features might be #### available? It will take a few weeks. I have to integrate the new techniques into the user interface. Additionally, I will write some user guides to explain how the new features are used. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Anonymous: for the super hi resolutions (2480x1024) we use a proprietary speed optimized compression algorithm. You can not work with uncomprssed data on normal PC in such resolution - HD and PCI bus data flow overload .... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Thanks Michal, - so if you wanted to use MPEG2 and didn't care about aspect ratios the maximum resolution would have to be 960 x 1080 per eye (=1920x1080)? David | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
David: No. Mpeg2 standard definitin (not HP HL or MP ML restricted levels) can work with data up to 4000x4000 or even higher. Even mpeg1 can do this (standardized up to 4096x4096 res, only few people know this and nobody use this) ... Mpeg2 definition group non-restricted decoders and encoders can work with such resoutions ... But you will fall on nose with CPU perfomance and escpecialy with disk acces and memory acces perfomance troubles ... But if you speek about encoders and decoders restricted by HP HL standard you are right for mpeg2 compression and the per eye resolution will be restricted by 1/2 of the HP HL definition ... So we use proprietary compression without any restriction ... | ||
| logfile Rating: N/A |
Is there anyone who tried to view 3D movies on LCD laptop successfully ? This is a naive question to some of you but I'm really interested in watching 3D movies on my laptop and would like to know so that I don't have to go thru all the setup trouble to find out it won't work. Seems that the problem with refresh rate of a LCD is similar to a TV, the other issue of polarized light is actually the show stopper, so is there a work around for this ? Thanks | ||
| John Billingham Rating: N/A |
I have tried it, just out of curiosity, and you might say it works 'marginally" at best. Assuming you could live with the 60 hz "flicker". The real problem is the "latency" of the LCD The switch between "fields" is NOT crisp. I don't know the "legality" of this, since "Win3D" is no longer a free download, but if you "had" a copy loaded, and also Masuji Suto's "StereoMovie Maker" you could try it yourself. (you will see a lot of the problems simply by trying the various "configurations" in Win3D) ( that is assuming you "had" Win 3D!) Have fun, nonetheless. John Billingham Why not use Peter Wimmer's software and view in anaglyph?( half color) | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: |
LCD switching time (not refresh rate of 60 Hz, but time crystals need to switch from black to white and vice versa) varies significantly among different LCDs. LCDs in notebooks are typically the worst one, because they are optimized for low power consumption, not for the best image quality. LCD monitors should be better, they are built keeping the needs of gamers in mind (fast movements require fast switching time to avoid tearing). Nevertheless, even the best LCDs are too slow for stereoscopic pageflipping technology. You will always perceive more ghosting compared to any ordinary CRT monitor. Finally, I recommend you to use an anaglpyh mode. Personally, I prefer true anaglyphs, but gray and half color anaglpyhs are also a good choice. Stereoscopic Player is capable of converting stereo videos to all of these anaglyph modes on the fly during playback. You can download it for free at http://mitglied.lycos.de/stereo3d/ | ||
| logfile Rating: N/A |
Thank you for very helpful answers . I'll try anaglyph mode . Is it possible to convert a 3D movies (done with Nuview & camcorder) back to regular format ? I'd like to be able to view the movie in either anaglyph mode or just plain normal 2D since it's not always convenient to wear the glass in public places. I understand there must be lost of half frame rate if it's possible at all to convert back to 2D format but that's OK for what I do. THanks again. | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
It is possible to convert a 3D movie to a 2D movie (the opposite is not really possible). If you only want to watch it 2D, use Stereoscopic Players monoscopic viewing method. If you want to convert it to a 2D video file, you can do this using VirtualDub (http://www.virtualdub.org) and some VirtualDub filters. I have not done this yet, so I cannot explain it in detail. You can also ask this question in the 3DTV Yahoo group (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/3dtv). | ||
| logfile Rating: N/A |
Special thanks to Peter for your work. I've donwload the player and am sure that will give me many moments of viewing pleasure. But for the moment I don't have a pair of anaglyph glasses and can't recall how the movie would look like with them on (I don't remember ever used these glasses). I've read the document for the player and realized that it does output "monoscopic" format, I take it that's "normal 2D" and probably of different (less ?) quality than normal 2D source. Please help me with the following questions: - I plan to make movies with Nuview and import into Windows Movie Maker format, can these be used with Peter's player ? - How does a movie made with Nuview setup looks under anaglyph glasses colorwise? - How does it look with "monoscopic" output format ? -And finally, could someone recommend a good pair of anaglyph that's ideal for using with Peter's player to view movie made using Nuview setup ? | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
I am not Peter but I thing I can give answer as well :-) 1) If you will use a non-deinterlacing compression for movie procesing (de facto only MJPEG or DV) it will work. You can not use in addition any operation producing deinterlacing (most filters and transition) 2) As bad as all anaglyphs. In Peter player you can chose betwen several methods .. 3) Horizontal resolution reduced to 1/2 of a normal movie rsolution. 4) Recomandation - anaglyph is obsolate, forget this and use sync doublinng or other shuterglasses method. But if you realy want to use anicent historical methods - prefer red-blu glasses (in comparison to red-green or red-cyan). They give better eye separation ... | ||
| logfile Rating: N/A |
Thanks M.H. for taking the time to answer. The reason I opt for anaglyph is because I want to view the movies on laptop. On my desktop I use shutter glasses. logfile | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Which Nvidia Quadro/FX cards supports dual hardware overlay? | ||
| Peter Wimmer Rating: N/A |
#### Which Nvidia Quadro/FX cards supports dual hardware overlay? None, I guess. Matrox Parhelia does. Anyway, for stereoscopic video playback it is useless. I do not know any player that supports dual hardware overlay. | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
Anonymous: For what reson do you need dual HW overaly ? Why not to use another technique like multitexturing e.t.c. ... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
M.H.: Please can you tell me more about multitexturing and etc. ? Thanks JB | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
JB: Sorry, I did not catch the topic ... Multitexturing is just a fast method how to combine 2 images ... Dual overaly is something else - overaly working on 2 monitors ... But with DirectX9 doing the same as dual overaly without dual overaly this mode have no sence ... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Great site guys, please let me know if you are interested in exchanging links with us. | ||
| Charles Barone Rating: N/A |
Reading postings on this site made me feel like a rank amatuer.....I bought a Sharp 15" flat panel 3D monitor because they reduced the price by half. All I know about 3D is the fabulous Stereo realist pictures my dad took when I was a kid. I never forgot them. I wanted to digitze them for computer and isplay them on a 3D monitor. But the idea of 3D video blew me away. I have no clue how best to record, edit, and display 3D video to this new monitor. If anyone can currently accomplish this and wants to share knowledge or experience, please let me know! All the best. Chas |
