| Author | Message | ||
     Raeldor Rating: N/A |
I thought their OLED HMD's were due out by now. Has anyone had a chanc to try the TriVisio 3Scope (http://www.trivisio.com/tech_3ScopeGoggles.html), and would care to comment on the display quality? Thanks All | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
This is the content from my last e-mail from Daeyang (Wed, 7 May 2003): "We are planning to release it in the market around the beginning of 2004. Why don't you use the model currently available ? That is DH-4400VP. Thank you, S. J. Choi" And for 3Scope, I got the reply from TriVisio that it's not compatible with regular 3D drivers. Best regards, Lars Ahnland (gamer and journalist) | ||
| Raeldor Rating: N/A |
I did manage to get individual left and right outputs from the VGA and DVI ports on my NVidia card at one point. I haven't tried it with the latest drivers, but if that would work then the 3Scope would be compatible. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
More3d has a software package that may help with L and R signal separation. http://www.more3d.com | ||
| mike Rating: N/A |
So does this mean if you own a Dual output HMD, you really need this more3d software to get stereo? I couldn't really tell what the US price was, does anyone know? Is it really $$$$$ Mike | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
mike: OpenGL stereoscopic proffesinal applications in combination with Quadro card can do the redirection without additinal software ... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
So I need a Quadro card to have this work? Any perticular type of quadro? Mike | ||
| M.H. Rating: N/A |
If you want to have automatic rediraction of pro OpenGL stereoscopy (no more 3d wrappers) the answer is yes. Any dual output quadro (e.g. 750 XL) will work. I have an old cheap Quadro 2 MMX dual output made by HW cracking from GeForce 2 MMX dual output and it works perfectly as well (original price 60 USD :-) ) ... | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
S. J. Choi, When are you guys going to make something people really want. This is what I am looking for at least 90 degree FOV and at lease 1280x1024 resolutions (prefer 1600x1200) for under $1500.00 BTW. Your current model use eye-cups, it would be nicer if it could be mounted on a helmet. Just my 2 cents. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
BOPrey, r u seious? U r asking for the impossible with todays tech. | ||
| amigo Rating: N/A |
What is so impossible about 1280x1024 microdisplays? They are out there just not available in VR applications/products for public sector. They are probably in HUDs in fighter jets or other military airplanes. Military market is always a better paying than civilian so we only see stuff after a few years/decades once it becomes obsolete to the Military and the technology becomes cheap enough for some company to mass produce it for the public sector and make profit...else they dont bother because if HMD would cost $5,000, typical consumer is not going to buy that  | ||
| Steve@IIS Rating: N/A |
Anyone want to guess what a single SXGA display costs? Steve @IIS | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
Quantity 1? Last time I heard was around $1500 | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Plz tell us Steve. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Isn't OLED going to be uber cheap? Hopefully there will be a quality hmd around before i buy my PS3! (2006)........ what i want - 3d head tracking, 64bit colour, WXGA, 100+ fov.... Any futurists want to guess what will be around commercially around 2006? | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
Erm, way things are going I would guess stereoscopic, SVGA, head tracking, 45 FoV may be available for $1000 if we are lucky. If things go very well, then we might see an XVGA, 60 fov for around $3000. That's my guesstimate anyways. We are only talking just over a couple of years away. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
My guesstimate is the above (SVGA, 45 FOV, etc...) sometime next year. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
SVGA with 45 FOV is useless. I would say at least 90 FOV and no less than 4 arcmin of resolution. Ray, XVGA is 1024x768, at $3000 per, how big do you think the world market is? Certainly not very big, but not small either. Any how, it will not be a market which you will see a lot of companies jumping into. My 2c | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
I wouldn't say SVGA was useless. I had a Sony LDI-D100BE which was SVGA, 45 degrees (approx) and stereoscopic... it was great fun, especially on flight simulator. I appreciate micro displays are expensive now, but the original poster did specify 2006. I would like to think there is a chance that the OLED market may be emerging by then. I am also talking to a company atm who claim to be developing the very technology I was describing and are starting mass production of 45 degree units in November and hope to have 60-120 degree units by mid 2004. I will keep the board posted when I can confirm more information. Regards | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
Imagine having a 120 FOV unit on a 800x600 microdisplay. You will see each pixel as big as you thumb. Just do the calculations. If the image is projected one meter (1000 mm) in front of you, at 120 FOV (horizontal), the image width is 1000 * tan(60) * 2 = 3464.1 mm. At 800x600 res, the size of each pixel is 3464.1 / 800 = 4 mm. How is that for Virtual Reality. | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
My bad, I should have mentioned these new units have a resolution of 1280 x 1024. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
The resolution is acturally higher if it is in stereo 3D. It would be even higher if you allow some degree of overlap. However, even you use no overlap with 1280x1024, you are still looking at a pixel size of greater than 1 mm. Now, how much are those high res units cost? I seriously doubt the they will cost less than $400US per (with head tracker), which is the break point for mass market. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Ray Price, are you talking about the x-viewer or the upcoming Daeyang HMD? | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
I am getting EXCITED.... | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
No, I don't think we will see a mass market product at that price point for another 5+ years. I didn't get a reply back from the company confirming the price yet. The original quote for the 45deg FOV was $1,500, which seems EXTREMELY cheap for a 1280x1024 HMD. The company I am referring to is http://www.deocom.co.kr/ENG-index.html Regards | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Ray, can you tell us some more about the mass production? What did they say exactly? | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
To quote... Thank you for your e-mail. We start massproduct at edn of NOV. We have Demo sample running in my office. DEOCOM HMD Specification is ; -. Type : Stereo Scopic -. Resolution : SXGA(1280X1024 : 1,300K Pixels per each) -. Field of View : 45 deg (D) -. Screen Size : 80inch at 2meter -. Input Signal : Composite(NTSC), S-Video, Analog RGB, DVI -. Power : Ext SMPS(5V, 3.3V) -. Others : TV Tuner Include -. Product Config : Controller with Head set and from the second email... Thanks The HMD is Basic resolution SXGA and Low resolution up scal fuction. We standard FOV is 45 deg. And avalible 40deg, 35deg. And DEV 60deg, 120deg. - plen is middle of 2004 Where are you address ? If you live in USA then connect branch office. The price is not yet. (About U$1,500.00) Although I have no communication from them since on my followup questions. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
Do they include a head tracking unit? A good head tracker will run you another $1000. | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
I doubt it. I already have an Intertrax2 anyway :P | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
On the website they say their HMD got see-through glass, like sunglasses. Will this not distort gaming, or can it be turned off? | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
I would imagine it would be like the Sony HMD's where you can set the amount of see-though or turn it off. If it says it can be used for gaming (which it does) then it suggests it can be turned off too. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
I hope so. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
Ray, I want to ask about your opinion about the mind set behind DEOCOM. If they can get 1280x1024, would'nt you make the FOV (120 degrees) as large as possible. By setting the FOV to 45 degree, they are effectively reducing the market size greatly. Prospects like me are not going to spend $1500US for something that has a FOV of only 45 degrees. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
45 in FOV is a hell of a lot more than what's available today; 26 in FOV with the i-glasses. But with the 60 FOV HMD coming up mid 2004 it's very tempting to wait fro that one. | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
I hear you BOPrey, that was one of my questions to them that they never responded too, lol. Dunno if I pissed them off :S I think the reason we see smaller FOV's is because there are really three markets for HMD's 1) Secure viewing. People who want to be able to view and edit sensitive documents and emails in public places such as on a plane etc. 2) Augmented reality. See though HMD functionality with overlayed information, such as a heads up display (like terminator :P) 3) Total immersion. Gamers and true VR. Applications 1 and 2 require a small FOV because if the FOV is too large the eye will be scanning a large area which will result in eye fatigue. Personally I would like to think that market 3 outweights markets 1 and 2 considerably, but I haven't done the market research to confirm this... maybe these companies have. I am waiting to hear back from this company, but the lack of response has set the alarm bells ringing again. $1,500 for a 1280x1024 HMD is insanely cheap (though you may not think so) when you look at the state of the microdisplay market today. I hope I am proved wrong, and that they come through. Cost wise. My limits atm are $3000 for a 60 degree FOV, $5000 for a 120 degree fov. Would be an interesting study to see how much most people are prepared to spend. I don't think the technology will be a a price point for most consumers for many years to come. | ||
| Ray Price Rating: N/A |
BTW, you guys may want to contact the company too... see if you can get some more information from them. If they see that there is genuine interest, they may be more inclined to divulge some more information? | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
Ray, "Secure viewing", I never thought of that one. When I purchased my i-glasses a year ago, the sale person did mention something like the i-glasses is every good even for use as computer display for word processing; but secure viewing never came across my mind. Sure, 45 degree FOV is best for secure viewing and 60 degree FOV is best for watching videos. As for augmented reality, there are still several different variations. Some of them requie a FOV to be as large as that of total immersion. Even some see through applications require very large FOV. From their FOV selection of the product, it won't surprise me that they are shooting for the market of see through augmented reality. After all, this type of HMD benefit a variety of industries (e.g. manufacturing, on field training). Kind of casting a bigger net. PS. You can even watch adult movies in public. LOL. I email the company and try to twist their arms for more info. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Ray Price, why don't u make a new topic of the Deocom HMD? | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Sounds like another x-viewer... Or maybe the price is right, something has to come out eventually! 120fov would be awesome | ||
| Steve@iis Rating: N/A |
That wasn't very nice | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Sorry, i know the market is small and considering the cost to make them... If the x-viewer came out now, and you knew the demand would be good, how much would they be? btw: by the looks of the renders deocom has, and the other products they are selling i'd say they would be way behind in marketing this thing.. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Steve at IISVR, any news about the x-viewer? We are all waiting... | ||
| Steve@IIS Rating: N/A |
Had one running in my office yesterday, stereo DVD's, looked great. No release date yet, but we are getting there. Steve | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Steve, Any pictures of the prototypes available? It would help stir up some excitement. Kevin | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
What is FOV and resolution of the x-viewer? | ||
| Steve@IIS Rating: N/A |
Sorry guys. You will have to wait a little while longer. Steve@IIS | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Has the x-viewers' specs been changed a little bit.. Is that part of the lengthy release.. to compete with other newer hmds'? Can you tell us if headphones can be used with the x-viewer, i'm quite fond of my sennheisers... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Steve, this is Lars Ahnland, swedish 3d-gamer and journalist. I´ve contacted you before about the x-viewer. I learned that the x-viewer project has been on hold for quite some time now. What is the status of the project now? Hove you reentered it? | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
daeyang oled svga 3d development kit http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/031029/295356_1.html looks like 2004 will be another step for vr, considering the x-viewer is bound to come out aswell. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
That´s eMagin, not Daeyang. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
sorry.. i was reading this at the time... eMagin Corp. and Daeyang E&C Co., Ltd. announced that Daeyang has signed a purchase agreement for over US$8 million of eMagin's microdisplays and optics for delivery during the remainder of 2002 and 2003. eMagin's SVGA-3D OLED-on-silicon display with built in stereovision capability will be incorporated into wearable consumer headset displays (HMDs, also known as face-mounted displays or FMDs in Asia) to be produced by Daeyang for electronic games, personal-computer accessories, and other applications. Daeyang currently produces head-mounted display devices, as well as other electronic consumer products. eMagin's OLED microdisplays will first be applied to Daeyang's upcoming stereovision 3D FMD with head tracker to penetrate into the consumer game market. Daeyang believes the anticipated successful mass production of OLED microdisplay panels triggered by this contract will significantly encourage Daeyang's strategic expansion into the emerging virtual-reality industry. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
That is old news. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Yes.. my point was that the hmd market will be competive in 2004. Since we have all been waiting to see how much money these companies think they will profit in regard to the products they release... Also i read somewhere that toshiba or someone has made bendable lcd's which would improve hmd's fov quite a bit.. i thought oleds were bendable aswell? or is the fov inhibited by the resolution? as someone said before... | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
The big question when it comes to Daeyang is their finacial situation. The Cy-visor must have been an economical disaster to them, since about half of the units had manucaturng defects (according to retailer Virtual Realities), and had to be returned and refunded. How does this affect their future work? | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
According to Virtual Realities, the manufacturing defects only occure in the stereo 3D product, not the 2D ones, and the 2D ones out sold the 3D ones. There is another issue with very large FOV. In order to achieve wrap around vr, lens alone will not be able to do the job. Some kind of len/mirror combination has to be designed, which will definitly complicate the manufacturing process. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
OK. I hope the misfortune with the 3D model don´t stop them from making a new OLED 3D HMD though. | ||
| Sandir NL Rating: N/A |
BOPrey: Vrealities is incorrect when they say the the Cy-visor problem was with the 3D version alone. The 2D version is equally if not worse than the 3D as far as quality control. | ||
| BOPrey Rating: N/A |
SandirNL, It did matter whether the problem with 2D or 3D. When I was ready to purchase a HMD, I was looking for 3D to begin with since I was going to use it mainly for flightsim gaming. So a decision was make to buy 3D only. I finally went with an i-glasses. However, the limited FOV and weight distribution of the unit (this is also with most of the consumer HMDs) prevent me from using it every day for gaming. | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
Hello, What a beautiful and awesome site. I adore what you've done with your setup and graphics. Thanks you so much. |
