| Author | Message | ||
     Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
I read on the i-Art board that they may make a wired 4-in-1 version of the Eye3D PCI, if they sell enough of the 3-in-1 version... | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Currently, we just announced the 3-in-1 of PCI wired glasses only, it's for cost down purpose. The 4-in-1 design is ready. (ps the 3-in1 & 4-in1 use same PCB.) Kenny Sales Manager i-Art Corporation http://www.iart3d.com | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny, will your Eye 3D 4-in-1 PCI wired have manual controls for everything like the new Another Eye 2000? Their remote control on the wire seems a great idea! | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi werner, The Eye3D PCI card is a cost down model, it's for bundle business purpose. All of functions was controlled by Activator v2.0 software with L/R reverse button. (4-in-1). We thought, the another Eye2000 materials cost is very expensive. it's not a good idear for future. Our thinking, the 3D glasses will be a standard package with PC in the future ( like the mouse or keyboard), the materials cost must be cheaper. We even will announce a microchip IC for 3D monitor purpose, except the monitor cost, the end user just pay under US$ 10 to get 3D glasses package. This is our thinking, how do you think ? Kenny | ||
| Christoph Bungert (Admin) Rating: N/A |
You should port the Activator to Linux and Mac. This shouldn't be too much work and there would be a product I could recommend to users of these OS. Christoph | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny, I yet have little experience with 3d glasses, but just reading all the info on this great site (gratulation Christoph), I would think that while it is a good idea to aim 3D glasses to be standard with computers it would probably be enough to make a cheap 2-in-1 model with pageflipping and interlace support through good drivers and a more expensive 4-in-1 solution for specialists including the older 3D methods. | ||
| A_Schulz Rating: N/A |
Nice idea, Kenny ! Now, if you could only convince NVidia, 3dfx, Matrox et al. to add native page-flip stereo to their chips and drivers... (with a big apology to all those nice people at metabyte and vrstandard ;-) | ||
| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
I have heard on Streovision.net that nVidia have some strero3d stuff in their news drivers... it wont take too long before we can see 3d glasses sold by the huge companies like Creative Labs, nVidia and even 3dfx. On that, I've seen on the 3dfxgamers message board that the voodoo5 6000 could be shipped at a extra cost with 3d glasses made in 3dfx. Wish I wont crap like those "Monster shades" S3/diamonnd was supposed to ship. | ||
| Andreas Schulz Rating: N/A |
And 3dfx news has it that V5-6000 won't be shipped at all : http://www.3dfx.com/comp/news/rel-13nov.html | ||
| John Rating: N/A |
Hi all, I've had my 4-in-1 glasses for one week now. I use them everyday. What a wonderful toy, uhh I mean tool... ;-) I'm curious, how long should the batteries last? I've begun fabricating a "wired" dummy battery using solid nylon rod, stainless steel bushing and pin, and a 6v/200mA ac wall adapter. I have to dig thru my old ATT Tech books to remember how to stepdown the amp output of the adapter. I knew I spent all that time and money for something! My wife said I have to finish the fish tank hood I started last week (15 20watt halogens and 3 20watt UVs on sequential timers) before I can start this new project.So I'll let you all know how it goes in about two or three weeks. Oh yea, Kudos to chris and the 3-qubed team on their new web site. If you haven't seen it yet go check it out. John | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Werner, for our experience, if you using the page-Flipping & Interlace, of cause the cost will little bit lower. but our thinking is the 3D video compress problem. we need consider the 3D video functions in IC. The Sync-Doubling is a best choose. another reason is, the Page-flipping & Interlace modes have the graphic cards compatiable problems. How do you think ? If you have further comments, please let me know. Kenny | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
hi, A_Schulz I'm sorry, I can't see your full name. so I call you A_Schulz . is OK ? before we have 3D monitor ideas, we have contacted all of graphic card chipset makers in Taiwan. finally, we give up this project, the reason as belows-- 1. the computer position problem -- maybe you'll put the computer under your table. if you've wired glasses , the wireld cable length is a problem. if you've a wireless glasses, you need a infrared cable connect with your graphic card than put the IR emitter on your monitor top. The IR cable length is a problem. that meaning the hardware is very difficult install. 2. Hardware installation problems -- 3. the chipset makers convince problems. Why we choose the 3D monitor solution as belows -- 1. Easy to installation -- Plug-in play 2. IR Emitter built-in monitor. 3. compatiable with all chipsets. 4. Top 1 & 3 micro chipset makers location in Taiwan. we are very easy to convince them to use this solution. 5. Taiwan is no.1 CRT monitor provider. The top 10 monitors in Taiwan will using this IC to make good profit . It's doesn't matter with the Metabyte & VRCaddy , because they just have a 3D game solution only, and Eye3D compatiabled with their drivers. our thinking, the 3D video marketing will big than the 3D game marketing in the future. for your reference only. Kenny | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi John, The batteries life around 80 hours continue using. when you stop your 3D game, please make sure the glasses power on/ off problem. The 3D-Qubed is distributer of i-Art in USA. Chris is my good friend. Nice to heard from you. Kenny | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny, regarding a cheap 2-in-1 wired solution, as someone here stated, at least NVDIA is starting to include 3d support into their reference driver, so maybe we will soon have pageflipping and interlace solutions with native driver support! As far as I know sync doubling and line blanking provide only half the resolution so this is a big minus! Also Asus and ELSA don't have these modes too. BTW maybe you should talk with Creative Labs about such a product to make a OEM kind of deal keeping them up with the NVIDIA competition... | ||
| Andreas Schulz Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny ! (Maybe you'd better call me 'Lazy Fingers' - well, maybe not any more after this message..;-) With all those news from NVidia, looks like at least one chipset maker became convinced.. After all, the monitor IMHO would be the perfect place for glasses controller, both for user (IR emitter/glasses jack right on the desk) and developer (most chips and signals needed, even power, already there). For the controller modes, 4-in-1 should be the way (and hardly more expensive, either). Since you're going for sync-doubling anyway (supporting also Wicked3D gaming), page-flip/interlaced syncing should be an easy add-on (and support ELSA, VRCaddy and, probably, the new NVidia drivers). The required circuitry for line-blanking should also be almost all present, and would allow support for alternate-line stereo, e.g. for web-images (Cult3D VR plugin comes into my mind - and again VRCaddy for gaming). Since X-Mas is getting close, some more points on my wishlist:
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| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Werner, The full page-Flipping 800x600 almost same as Interlace 1600 x 1200 resolutions . The Elsa best resolution is 1024 x 768 x 100 Hz, it'll have flicker problems if can't reach 120Hz of refresh rate. this is monitor bandwidth (Regular 17" minitor) problems. the Sync-Doubling mode additional almost don't have any extra cost, becase it already built-in IC. if the cost is same, 3-in-1 or 2-in-1, which one you'll chose ? Otherwise, i-Art major is focus to the video(MPEG1/MPEG2/MPEF 4) marketing in the future. I think the Sync-doubling mode is bestest choose. Kenny | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Lazy fingers, You have a agile fingers , not lazy fingers. Thank you for your comments, we'll keeping in our mind. Re your comments, my answered as belows - 1. L/R reverse controller -- it'll contrl by OSC IC firmware or software. etc .. 2. VESA mini DIN-3/3.5mm phone jack for wired glasses was ready. 3. Currently, don't have any standard color codes announce, we'll try to add all of color codes in firmwar to support all of glasses . it's not easy to do I think. I think, the wired glasses will under US$ 5 per unit. wireless glasses will under US$ 10 per unit. 4 & 5 points, could you please let me know in details. thank you. Regarding the 3D monitor, please refer the website at http://www.bridge.com.tw for details. Please keeping in touch. Have a nice day Kenny | ||
| Andreas Schulz Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny! To clarify : 3. Wasn't talking about color control codes (no much need as long as there is manual control), but IR signals for 'legacy' wireless glasses for those who already got some. 4. Found that (some?) shutters in fact should be switched a little (few scan lines) before the VSync pulse, since otherwise there will be a dark band in the top screen area due to the switching latency of the LCDs (like Chris complained about in his AnotherEye2000 review). 5. Similar to the old H3D controller, which does sync-doubling at low refresh rates (to avoid monitor stress by doubling to ~200Hz or more) and line-blanking at high refresh rates (to avoid flicker), with threshold at ~80Hz. Threshold should be adjustable to user's preferences/graphics controller capabilities. | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny, if cost is not that critical just make a 4-in-1 wired and everyone will be happy! Regarding sync doubling at 1600x1200 being as good as page flipping at 800x600, even modern graphic cards are not able to make games playable at this resolution so page flipping would be still better! P.S.: When will the 4-in-1 be done? Because as you said, I wouldn't buy a 2-in-1 instead of a 3-in-1, but also no 3-in-1 when I know there is a 4-in-1! Maybe it would be wise to skip the 3-in-1 at all and release the 4-in-1 if the price difference is not that high. BTW how high will the latter be? | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Oops, I meant interlace at 1600x1200 in my latest message. Kenny, what prices do you estimate for the bundle 3-in-1 and the retail 4-in-1 at all? | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Werner, I'm agreed your viewpoint. the page-Flipping is better than Sync-Doubling in the 3D game. The Sync-doubling mode -- we focus to the Video platform in the future, because it don't have any graphic cards compatiable problems in video platform . it also don't have file compress problem. The Line-Blanking mode is a hardware solution, it'll have some materials cost additional. Around US$ 4 to 5 per unit. If for the bundle purpose -- this mode isn't suitable for use. Could you please let me know bundle with what kinds of products ? for example to me . thanks. The Eye3D supported to 2048 x 1536 resolution, we've tested it before. it's depend on your graphic card & monitor. for your reference. | ||
| Werner Spahl Rating: N/A |
Hi Kenny, if the difference is really only $5 I would skip the 3-in-1 wired. This is a difference noone will care about, when they get a mode more. Regarding the bundle I would approach the graphic card producers that don't offer any 3D like 3dfx, ATI and Matrox. Maybe they will be able to include a wired 4-in-1 with their next products like ELSA and Asus do with some of their NVIDIA cards right now. Especially for 3dfx who needs to get back on top for games this could be a bonus. Seeing that their greatest rival NVIDIA is already including 3D into their reference drivers this would be an opportunity to catch on, best providing their own drivers. Have you ever approached these companies? | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Werner, We've approached so many graphic makers in Taiwan, but don't get good response. the reason as belows -- 1. PCI cost must be lower . 2. The 3D game application is not stronger for marketing. 3. 3D contents provide (3D Education, 3D Video titles etc .... ). 4. Plug-in play ( the game driver installation problems.) I think the ELSA, ASUS are not successful in marketing. because the 3D game application not stronger. we'll announce some softwares in the future -- 1. 2D --> 3D software (real time), the quality almost same as real 3D 2. 2D --> 3D Software (Off line) If done, it'll solve the 3D content problem. I think the marketing will fast grow up at that time. How do you think ? | ||
| Michal Husak Rating: N/A |
For Kenny: I disagree that the above/below concept + sync dobling for stereo-video is O.K. . It is too big trade of price-quality in compariosn with HW page flipping and stereo movie in full resolution for both eye. | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Michael, If you don't consider the file compress probelm, yes, I agreeed with your concept. | ||
| Michal Husak Rating: N/A |
What do you mean under compress problem ? 1) Deinteralcing of interlaced video ? It is not true for non-deinterlacing compresions as MJPEG, DV, MPEG2 in non-progresive mode ... 2) To big amount of data ? In this case 1+1 does not equal 2. Inteligent stereoscopic compresion could utilise the left and right eye similarity. In this cas 1+1 could equal 1.15 in the same quality. The only one problem is that nobody takes cares about practical usage of such modifed mpeg2 algoritmes developed on sevral Univ. some time ago ... 3) To much computer power nessesery for decompresion and handling of 2 stereoscopic images in full resolution. Yes, that is true now. But it will change during a year or so according trends in the CPU development ... My oven opinion that full HW page fliped video format in full stereoscopic resolution for both eye is the format for near future. Above/below is an working compomise now .... | ||
| Larry Crew Rating: N/A |
People talked about Chris and 3-Qubed but didn't mention the URL it is http://www.demensional.com | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Michael, Yes, I agreed with your viewpoint. Thank you BTW, May I have a question -- Do you have any idears for the 2D convert to real 3D software (MPEG 1 format) in real time. I've received this kind of software sample from Korea company, it seems is good. Kenny | ||
| RobT Rating: N/A |
I just wanted to say thanks to I-Art and Kenny for your companies' presence on what is probably the most influential public medium in this somewhat small, but growing industry.. You rarely see companies taking the time these days to help people in this way. To comment on previous, i think that you can't just package an awesome product like eye3d with a well known product like 3dfx voodoo5 and just assume that the eye3d is going to be catapulted into the top 10 most sought after products.. If people don't know what it is or how to use it, i think the only advantage that will bring is that more people will have heard of the product. I think it's more important to somehow bring the awareness of the eye3d to the general public UP, make them want it, and THEN make it available to them. In other words, it has to work without having to try to hard.. People don't like to fiddle with things for too long, i know this too well from working computer tech support. They aren't going to spend too long reading instructions or fiddling with driver modes. They want to plug the glasses in, load a game or application, and it just somehow works. If it goes any other way, they might spend a small amount of time reading the documentation depending on their temperment, and after a short time, they will be calling technical support. That's one of the biggest costs for hi tech companies- the cost of technical support. If the product works and it is EASY to make it work, the customer is happy and it costs the company less for technical support. Ya, that's all ignoring what it takes to make it work, all of the programming, researching drivers, all of that... But the bottom line is most people want to plug the glasses in, load an application and somehow, magically, it works. For most people, just having to wear glasses ALONE is enough to not even want to TRY it. But almost EVERYONE that i have seen try LCD glasses that thought that changed their minds saying that it's worth seeing in 3d... So packaging it with a big name like 3dfx voodoo 5 is important, but only part of the solution- if people buy 3dfx voodoo 5 and get eye glasses for free, what's it to them if they never heard of shutter glasses, eye3d, or ever heard anyone's opinions who have used them? RobT | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi Rob, Thank you for your suggestions, We knew this kind of problems for a long time. If you focus in 3D game, yes you'll get some software installation problems. honestly to said, we can't solve this kind of problems, except have a big leader company (like the Microsoft company (D3D)) to release the 3D standard specification. We'll focus in 3D video in the future, because the 3D video marketing is huge than 3D game, how do you think ? We've announced the 3D PowerDVD already, which software is for 3D MPEG I/II video in PC platform, it don't have any software installation problems. Otherwise, we'll stopped the Eye3D PCI product, because the External box of Eye3D (Wired) will announce in this month. I'll send a sample to Christoph for evalution soon. Regarding this logo of package, We'll think about how to improve it, but We thought the quality is more imprtant than logo on first step, how do you think ? Thank you again, please keeping in touch. Happy new year for you & your family. Kenny | ||
| RobT Rating: N/A |
I'm not sure what you mean by "the External box of Eye3D (Wired) will announce in this month", does this mean there is a new version of eye3d coming out? Is the only difference that it is wired? 3d DVD i'm sure will be a significant step, there are many more people who love movies more than they love 3d games, so i'm sure this will be a great thing. Alot of people watch DVD through a dedicated DVD player and television- is there a way to use the eye3d in a NTSC DVD system like this, with no PC? On you question if i thought 3d video was a bigger market than 3d gaming- ya- i actually answered it above without realizing it so, i think i agree completely. And it seems like it should be easier to use for people if they can use standard video equipment without a computer (i.e. plug the eye3d into NTSC video). NTSC i think would be limited to the 60hz, so there is flicker, i don't know if DVD has this limitation, but i'm guessing it does, and that's not good. I have also read that direct x 9 has some form of stereoscopic support, but haven't read details yet, you probably are already aware of this. In NTSC, if you record a field for left, a field for right, etc etc, you're halving the resolution, and creating flicker, i wondered if there would be any benefit at all to record two fields ( a frame) for each instead? That would lower the frame rate to 15 frames/second, but would there be any benefit for NTSC? I've been following the basics of stereoscopy for a few years, but have little practical experience. After i get the eye3d and some time, i plan on spending some time creating 3d video for NTSC. I worked with video professionally for a short time, and i think this would be fun to try, and to find all of the intricasies of 3d video- there's no doubt plenty of technical differences on the practical side of working with higher quality stereoscopic video, thought the audience for NTSC based video will remain somewhat small until 120hz televisions become more common. RobT | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
Hi RobT, The External Box of Eye3d is same as the Eye3D PCI wired, it'll solve the hardware installation problem, the user don't open the PC case to install the hardware any more. The Eye3D just for PC platform only. We've a 3D TV unit for NTSC & PAL system, but the flicker is still have problem until now. First step, we'll focus in 3D Video(MEPG I/II SVCD) on PC platform, because the flicker issue. Currently, the major problems is the content supporting, if we could solve this problem, that the 3D marketing will grow up fastest. Our Road Map as belows for your reference -- 1. 2D convert to CD software -- PC platform. 2. 2D convert to 3D off line -- PC platform. 3. Real 3D -- PC platform. Of cause, it can be NTSC & PAL system at same time. If you have own 3D titles, may I have a copies from you for evalution. thank you. Kenny | ||
| Kenny Rating: N/A |
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| Anonymous Rating: N/A |
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