| Author | Message | ||
     Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
I'm interested in connecting up my Eye3d box to my brand spanking new InFocus IN-76 projector to see about going big-screen 3d. (It's 1280x720p DLP which, based on other posts here, I think should work for this, but it won't hurt to try at any rate!) The problem I have is that I'm using nVidia GeForce 7800 graphics cards which only have DVI out. THat's not a problem because I can use a DVI-VGA adapter to connect to the Eye3d box, but that's where I start to run into trouble. THe projector is, effectively, DVI only. OK, that's not strictly true, it has a special M1 connection and I use a long DVI-M1 adapter cable to get to the projector, but at any rate the cable for the PC side is a DVI cable. I'm wondering if anyone else out there has some experience in this on any good ways to get that VGA back out to DVI with just some kind of adapter, or if I'm just stuck shelling out for a VGA-DVI converter (and shelling the big bucks out for something that still might not work is not something I relish.) | ||
| Clyde (Clydd) New member Username: Clydd Post Number: 2 Registered: 4-2006 Rating: N/A |
Time to get the bat signal out to Michal Husak !! he should be able to answer this.. also Michal if you reading this..a silly question... will the Quadros do stereo on BOTH DVi outs? of a Quadro card? or just the primary one like a regular Nvidia FX card | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 15 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Clyde: I'm not Michal Husak (and cerainly don't have his level of technical expertise), but I can answer your question. I have a Quadro FX 1100 graphics card with dual DVI outputs, and it is possible to get stereoscopic images from both outputs at the same time, at least with the display setting configured for CLONE mode. (I have a CRT monitor connected to one DVI port and a DLP pprojector connected to the other, and both will show the same image in 3-D simultaneously.) | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
Thanks, but that's not what I'm looking for. I only need output from one DVI port and need to go to DVI input. The problem is that all of the 3d dongles I have (or have seen) are VGA on both ends. Easy enough to turn that DVI out to VGA in, but then taking that VGA out and turning back to DVI in is what I'm wondering if I will have problems doing. | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 16 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Lenny: If you convert the signal to VGA and then back to DVI, the result will be a visible loss of image quality. (I don't recommend spending $$ on a VGA-DVI converter to prove this.) Here's a possible solution: IF your GeForce 7800 card is capable of sending a stereoscopic signal through both of its DVI ports simultaneously in CLONE mode (like the Quadro FX 1100 card), you can connect the dongle to one DVI port and the projector directly to the other DVI port, and the shutter glasses will be in synch with the projected image. | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
Oh! I see what you mean! Let me give that a try... Thanks! | ||
| Clyde (Clydd) New member Username: Clydd Post Number: 3 Registered: 4-2006 Rating: N/A |
Charles.. spot on! ..i feel a bit guilty not being able to answer that one myself (lenny's question), but I doubt that geforce do stereo on both outs (even the 7800) still I dont have that board to cant comment. Meanwhile thankyou for confirming the Quadro Dual stereo out question. saves me lots of time in trying to get the compter shop to let me "try" it out myself. none of them are willing to open up unit for me  Best regards CLyde | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 6 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
It's possible that if the signal is not sent out both ports that I may still get it to work anyone since my setup is with dual 7800s in SLI mode, so even if the second port won't send the syncing signal possibly I can get the second card to do so, instead. I haven't been able to do any testing on this yet, but I'll try to remember to report back any results within the next few days. | ||
| Michal Husak (Husakm) Member Username: Husakm Post Number: 58 Registered: 4-2006  Rating: N/A |
We have another solution - we had build a DVI-DVI pass through dongle with the stereo signal extraction ... Unfortunatley the interest it this solution is so low, that we did not put it to mass production, but generlay it works ... If you have a good electro ingeneer availabe, you can do the dongle yourself ... DCC on one signal pin, ground and power on the rest ... | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 7 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
After preliminary testing, it looks like I had to take the cards out of SLI mode in order to setup a dual display setup. I could only really get it working as a clone setup, though, and in that mode only the primary display would work in 3d mode, not both. I may have to try doing some more work to see if I can get this spare LCD monitor I have to work in desktop extension mode, but so far no luck. MAYBE in that mode I can get the signal to go out both ports correctly. Will report back if I can figure out something more. | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 8 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
Here's the latest. I did get spanning to work (just had to find a compatible horizontal res between the two monitors) but only the primary display would do the stereo display (other screen would go black) and since I need the signal to go out both outputs I'm, once again, dead in the water. However I did find a couple of possibilities. http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/DVI-hdmi_adapt.html Lists a DVI-I to DVI-D and VGA adapter/Splitter DVI-I male to DVI-D female and VGA female splitter adapter which I am hoping might mirror the signal out to both a DVI and a VGA port at the same time. I also ordered the adapter labeled "VGA style HD15 female and a DVI-A male connector". Which I have no clue if it will work or not, but I figured I could give it a shot and see what we get. I expect to have it all sometime next week and will report back then with the results. | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) New member Username: Charles Post Number: 18 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Lenny: Remeber that if the splitter is used to send the images to two separate displays simultaneously (for example, a monitor and a projector), you will probably get degraded images in both displays. If you are planning to connect only a dongle to the splitter along with the projector, you MIGHT succeed in splitting the synch signal and getting a decent projected image. Assuming the cost of the splitter is relatively cheap, you're right -- it might be worth a shot. Good luck, and keep us posted of your results. | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 11 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
Well, I got the parts today. No luck. I didn't really expect just using the reverse VGA-DVA adapter would work, and it didn't. The projector simply didn't recognize that any kind of signal was coming in. Just a blank screen for that one. The splitter didn't duplicate the output. It acted like two seperate ports on the card, meaning it recognized the DVI-side projector and the VGA-side would only seem to operate if there was a monitor connected on the second DVI port of the card. Meaning multi-monitor mode and, hence, only the primary monitor would get the video sync signal. So that's no good either. I do have an adapter for the projector which uses VGA & USB to the M1 input on the projector, instead of DVI to M1. The cable is way too short, but I could see about using a VGA extension. I do hate doing that, though. I do have some spare dongles, though (well just different ones I ended up getting at different times, like an H3D one, an eDimensional one and such) so maybe trying Michal's idea is the best route to go and build my own DVI-DVI dongle. Michal, if you are still reading this, would you happen to have some pointers on which pins you had to connect to which wires to make that dongle? I'm not much of an electrical engineer or anything, but I know how to use a soldering gun (sort of ;)). Without clear instructions maybe some hints or websites would help steer me in the right direction, at least. | ||
| Charles Arrants (Charles) Junior Member Username: Charles Post Number: 22 Registered: 5-2006 Rating: N/A |
Lenny: Running VGA to M1 with an in-line dongle will definitely give you a viewable (albeit somewhat degraded from DVI quality) stereoscopic projected image. I used this method temporarily before purchasing a DVI to M1 cable for my projector. If you want to go ahead and watch some 3-D on your new projector before completing your custom-made DVI dongle, I'd recommend investing in a dirt-cheap VGA extension cable to use in the meantime. Please keep us posted on your work on the custom DVI dongle. | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 12 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
I ordered a VGA extension cable to do just that, at least for now. I also pulled apart the dongle section of my Eye3D Premium TX4000 transmitter (it was only a snap together piece, all my others are glued) and there is a small circuit board in there. Might make it a bit harder for me to rig up that one. I may try to pry apart the one on my nuVision box, though, as it appears to be a much smaller dongle and my have a more direct pin-out, so I may be able to try to figure out some of it from that. I also found a few sites with pinout descriptions of VGA and DVI-I connectors,but nothing on the 3d sync-side so I might better determine how I can covert things over. I'll certainly report back my findings. Thanks for all the help! | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 13 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
BTW, as a side note, for those running SLI graphics setups I find that you must disable the SLI mode for the stereo driver to work. If I have SLI mode enabled my system will blue-screen whenever it tries to switch to using the stereo driver. | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 14 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
As an update, I got in a VGA extension cable. Definitely some drop in video quality (not massive, but noticeable, at least on this size screen) going the analog route, but in general the 3d works. Although oddly the "Medical Test" from the nVidia properties screen didn't really seem to work correctly (it was like the sync wasn't matched up.) However, going to the Stereo Properties settings and doing the Test there was downright phenomenal. Far better than what I was used to seeing on a CRT display. I'm having issues getting it to work right in a couple of games I tried and the Stereo Player isn't quite working out, either, but I'll just need to do some more experimentation there to figure out what the problem is. On the DVI side of things, I'd definitely prefer to use some kind of DVI connection. On that front, though, I'm not too sure where to go. I'm guessing that I'm really only worried about moving whatever wires were connected in the original VGA HD15 connection to pins 6 (V Sync GND) and 14 (V Sync signal) in order to get the glasses synced up. But the question is where to conenct them on the DVI side and if it would even work. I would guess I could connect the pin 6 wire to C5 on a DVI-I connector (the Analog GND return?) or maybe pin 15 (Ground for +5V?) Would it work connected to pin 8 (which I have listed on my diagram as Analog vertical sync?) Would that still properly sync even though the video is really being sent digitally? Presumably I may have to worry y about the +5 V power connection as well depending on the controller I'm using? Or am I just way off track on all of this? | ||
| Uwe Glaessner (3dbruce) New member Username: 3dbruce Post Number: 7 Registered: 10-2008 Rating: N/A |
Hi, I'd like to build a DVI-based dongle to use with my revelator glasses. So if I understand this thread correctly, all I have to do is get a DVI-I extension cable and connect pin 15 (ground) and pin 14 (+5V) to a 3-pin mini-din socket and also pin 7 (DDC-data) for the signal. Is it really that easy? Do I have to cut the dvi-connection of pin 7 inside the cable to avoid interference with the DDC data transmisison between projector and PC as well? Last but not least: Is it possible to add some kind of TTL-inverter here to be able to invert the signal to the glasses and therefore to change the L/R orientation? Otherwise I would need some kind of software solution to do that because the Nvidia driver together with a DLP projector seems to reverse the L/R orientation by default. are there any foolproof layouts available online to do this? (I am not an electronic expert myself ;-) TIA - Uwe | ||
| Lenny Zimmermann (Zarlor) New member Username: Zarlor Post Number: 18 Registered: 11-2006 Rating: N/A |
Well, since I didn't get a response to my last postinf ( almost 2 years ago now!), you can probably guess that I never got it figured out, either. I keep hoping some kind sould would give some more explicit directions on if this can be done and how we can do it using what equipment. | ||
| Uwe Glaessner (3dbruce) New member Username: 3dbruce Post Number: 8 Registered: 10-2008 Rating: |
Hi, yesterday evening I completed to build a DVI-based dongle including L/R inversion to be used for DLP projection. The following steps will work with 3D glasses that are triggered using the DDC-conection, e.g. ELSA Revelator (probably also E-Dimensional, though I cannot guarantee that). 1. Get a standard DVI-Kabel and carefully open the plastic housing on one of the plugs. Mine also contained an additional metal housing consisting of two parts that were soldered together but could easiliy be separated. 2. Drill a hole into the housing big enough for an extra four-wire connection. I used a 4m long cable without problems. 3. Solder two of the wires of this cable to pin 15 (ground) and 14 (+5V) of the DVI-connector in addition to the already soldered wires from the DVI-cable. 4. Disconnect the cable to pin 7 of the DVI-connector and solder one of the remaining wires of your cable to this pin. 5. Connect the one remaining wire to the wire originally soldered to pin 7. 6. Get a 3 pin mini-din socket to connect it with e.g. an elsa revalator IR-transmitter (This worked for me, I cannot guarantee that any other VESA 3-pin IR-emitter will also work, though) 7. Solder Ground and +5V of the extra cable to the corresponding pins of the mini-din socket (The correct pin assignment can be found here: http://www.stereo3d.com/vesa3.htm ) 8. If you want to inverse the signal to your glasses so that you don't need a software solution, you'll also need a TTL-inverter. I used a 74LS04 Hex-inverter. (Thanks to the german electronics forum for the hint ;-) . To use this inverter you have to solder a) Ground and +5V to pins 7 and 14 of this IC respectively. b) The wire that is connected to Pin 7 on the side of the dvi-cable that will be plugged into the graphics card will receive the DDC signal. This must be connected to one of the inputs of the Hex-inverter, e.g. Pin 1. c) You can retrieve the inverted signal then on Pin 2 of the chip and connect that to the signal pin of your mini-din socket. No other electronic parts are necessary as the DVI signal is already TTL (I am completely out of my depth here, but that is what the german experts told me ;-) If your PC has problems recognizing your projector, because the DDC connection is missing, you can install an additional switch that transmits the DDC-signal back to the 4th wire of your extra cable. If this switch is closed your cable will behave exactly as a standard DVI cable. Maybe this description sounds too complicated, but the actual wiring is quite simple. Let me know if you have any additional question, I will be glad to help. And, last but not least, if you want to repeat this, do this at your own risk. Best regards - Uwe | ||
| Alan Johnson (Ajay501) Junior Member Username: Ajay501 Post Number: 21 Registered: 4-2006  Rating: N/A |
Great post, Uwe. Say, which projector are you using, and at which refresh rate? Are you using greater than 1024 X 768 at 85 Hz? | ||
| Uwe Glaessner (3dbruce) New member Username: 3dbruce Post Number: 9 Registered: 10-2008 Rating: N/A |
Alan, I made first tests with a Benq PE5120 but now have switched to a BENQ MP721, which works great at 85Hz using a resolution of 1024x768. AFAIK no projector with a higher resolution is capable of 3D with more than 60Hz. |
